Breaking Barriers in Tech: Kerry Ann King's Journey to Becoming a Founder in Her 50s | Ep #184

Are you thinking about pivoting into tech or launching your own business later in life? In this episode of Second Act Success, host Shannon Russell sits down with Kerry Ann King, CEO of Eluminate Labs, to discuss her inspiring journey from multiple career transitions to becoming a tech founder in her 50s.

Kerry Ann shares how she navigated layoffs, career shifts, and the challenges of being a woman in tech, ultimately building a software company focused on inclusivity and human well-being. She also dives into how her FIN Positive Productivity app is transforming task management by helping users create sustainable habits with real-time coaching.

Key Takeaways:

✅ Embracing career pivots: How Kerry Ann transitioned through multiple industries before launching her business
✅ Breaking into tech as a non-technical founder: Finding the right team and learning to lead in a male-dominated industry
✅ Building inclusive technology: Why tech should serve people, not exploit them
✅ The power of habits in career transitions: How small, consistent actions can prepare you for entrepreneurship
✅ Navigating layoffs and uncertainty: Turning setbacks into opportunities for growth

Tune in for an insightful conversation on entrepreneurship, resilience, and redefining success at any stage of life!

🔗 Connect with Kerry Ann King:
📍 Website: eluminatelabs.com
📍 App: FIN Positive Productivity (Available on iOS & Android)
📍 LinkedIn: Kerry Ann King
📍 Instagram & Facebook: @EluminateLabs

🎧 Subscribe & Review Second Act Success for more inspiring career and business advice and career transition stories!

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Transcript

Second Act Success Career Podcast
Season 1 - Breaking Barriers in Tech: Kerry Ann King's Journey to Becoming a Founder in Her 50s | Ep #184
Episode - #184
Host: Shannon Russell
Guest: Kerry Ann King
Transcription (*created by Descript and may not be perfectly accurate)

[00:00:00] Shannon Russell: Hey there. It's Shannon. Welcome back to second act success. I am bringing you a really interesting conversation with Kerry Ann King. 

The CEO of Eluminate Labs, a software development company dedicated to creating inclusion solutions for human wellbeing. 

Kerry Ann will share her path to becoming a tech founder in her fifties. She will talk about all of her ventures leading up to this. And what she is doing to make strides for women in the tech space. 

[00:00:29] Speaker 2: Are you ready to quit your nine to five job and start a business of your own? Well, you're in the right place, my friend. Welcome to the second act success career podcast. I am your host, Shannon Russell. I am a former television producer turned business owner, career transition coach, and boy mom. My mission is to help you produce your best life.

This podcast will teach you how to get from where you are now to where you want to be and how to build a business that fits your life and lights you up. [00:01:00] Let's get started.

[00:01:02] Shannon Russell: Welcome Kerry Ann King to the show. Thank you so much for being here. 

[00:01:07] Kerry Ann King: Hi, thank you. I'm so happy to be here. I'm so excited. 

[00:01:10] Shannon Russell: Yay! Well, you have such a great story, and a wonderful company, and have definitely gone through the second acts in your life. 

Where did your career begin? 

[00:01:20] Kerry Ann King: So it's funny that this is called second act success, but I would really say that I'm on like my third or fourth act. 

[00:01:27] Shannon Russell: A lot of guests say that. Yep. Right. Like I think we're fairly 

[00:01:30] Kerry Ann King: typical. 

[00:01:31] Shannon Russell: once you change once you can just keep adding on and doing different things. I think that's great.

[00:01:36] Kerry Ann King: and I think it's unrealistic in a certain sense. There are people who have wonderful careers that are a trajectory from A to Z without skipping a letter, without deviating into the numbers or the shapes or, but realistically, most of us need to have a path that's a little bit more winding.

[00:01:57] Shannon Russell: Yeah, I agree. I was actually just at my doctor's [00:02:00] appointment and I was telling her about my book that's coming out and it's called start your second act. And she said, well, I want the book, but I'm not starting a second act. Is that okay? I'm like, you are an OBGYN. You've got an amazing first act. You do not need to change.

But yeah, some people want to, you know, they started off, they put in their dues and they want to stick it out, but you and I are a little different. 

[00:02:22] Kerry Ann King: Exactly. I, I could go to the way way back, but I'll start kind of in the middle of the story. Many, many years ago, almost 21 years ago, I was pregnant for the third time with a set of twins, which is wonderful and exciting, but I also was on bed rest for a super long time.

, I was getting a PhD in clinical psychology, , wasn't loving seeing patients, but was enjoying a lot of the intellectual aspects of it, and then I had used my medical leave for my first two kids. I had no more medical leave. I was going to have to leave the program and reapply no matter what. [00:03:00] And actually I called the office secretary from a labor bed in the hospital.

Literally, I had gone into labor. , it was only 22 weeks. It was a big emergency and she never called me back. And in a certain sense, it may have been definitely a huge favor. , because what happened was once my, I had these four little kids, I started to look for something that I could do that was flexible.

So I went into group fitness. So that's kind of act one, moving into act two. , I loved act two. I loved being a group fitness instructor. It's a great job for a young mom, right? All I had to do was show up, have fun, look cute, be friendly and leave. I had a couple of. Yeah, I literally never saw my boss.

You know, they hired me because I had a reputation. They weren't there when I was teaching. I [00:04:00] wasn't there when they weren't. It was great. It was great for a young mom 

[00:04:03] Shannon Russell: and a great way to get in shape while you're helping others get healthy. 

[00:04:06] Kerry Ann King: Oh, absolutely. And that I used to say that to people all the time and they would say, you're in such good shape and supply made it my job, right?

If I were an accountant, I would be good at being an accountant. But I'm good at being in shape. , so anyway, I happened to get a job teaching one dance class a week at the Google offices in New York City. And that was really what started my third act. Largely because I complained. a lot about everything.

The studio wasn't clean. The class schedule didn't make sense. The, there was drop off in some of the classes attendance, but not others. And because of all the other work that I had done before that I even had a stint in marketing before I got my PhD and was getting my PhD in clinical psychology. So I had a lot of experience.

And I just applied it to everything [00:05:00] that was presented to me. And I was in an environment where people had the attitude. If someone has a good idea, we're going to let that person do something. You don't think the studio is clean, why don't you straighten it up? We'll pay you to do that. You don't think the schedule makes sense.

Why don't you tell us what you think it should be and we'll pay to do that. So I jokingly say I complained my way to the top. , exited that job as the director of community working for the, their, , fitness vendor, Exos. Really was excited about employee engagement and, , inclusion and those are all the things that I was really passionate about took a brief detour into pharma, ,

it was a pharma company where not to get too deep into the the pharma business model, but they had a molecule that had done very well that was going off patent. They were they didn't have a molecule to replace it. So their revenue [00:06:00] went from here to here. And when that happens, people lose their jobs.

But it was a great layoff. They were very generous and that actually got me into my fourth act, which is Eluminate Labs. 

[00:06:13] Shannon Russell: Okay, so you've had these different iterations of your career, , and then you had a layoff, which is again, in my opinion, another sign to take it to the next level, right?

And what made you want to head out on your own and start a business at that point? 

[00:06:28] Kerry Ann King: So it was a few things, some of them philosophical and some of them emotional. From an emotional standpoint, I think as a woman in tech, I did.

Frequently feel very thwarted. like my leadership skills were half recognized in a weird way. I got promoted, I got advanced. I never felt like I was really getting into the inner circle. 

[00:06:58] Shannon Russell: Okay. And 

[00:06:59] Kerry Ann King: [00:07:00] which was frustrating to me. from a career point of view, the idea of being able to have an organization where I was making the decisions and able to put myself in that position.

I've, I said to my husband, I'm going to give myself the title that I always wanted. 

[00:07:17] Shannon Russell: Exactly. Yeah. 

[00:07:18] Kerry Ann King: You 

[00:07:18] Shannon Russell: were the inner circle. 

[00:07:20] Kerry Ann King: Yeah, exactly. Now I am the inner circle. And then, from a philosophical standpoint, when we look at the way tech uses the consumer, and this has become more and more in my view problematic, it seemed to me that if we want tech to really be focused on human well being, not just from the point of view of like this app is supposed to make me a better person, or this software is supposed to help me be more efficient, but really focus on the impact that the tech has on us as individuals, that [00:08:00] you really had to start that From outside of big tech the importance of the algorithmic business model, the business model in tech that really exploits the consumer, it's just built into the business model.

It's part of the structure. So if we want to change that, we really need to step outside of it to make that change. 

[00:08:26] Shannon Russell: Tell me about your thoughts on what Eluminate Labs would be when you created it. 

[00:08:33] Kerry Ann King: I actually got started with a friend of mine who got laid off from Google. So 

He and I had known each other while I was at Google. We hadn't really worked directly together, but he was aware of what I had done and kind of my interest in productivity and human wellbeing and all that stuff. So we started working on it together. , and really that was about creating an inclusive.

app for people with [00:09:00] neurodivergence as a way to keep track of their time management, their tasks, and so on and so forth. We were coming at it he from kind of like a to do list perspective and me more from a psychological perspective of how our feelings about the things we have to do either. or hinder our ability to get them done.

So that was really the, core projects that we started working on. But then for me, it was really important not to start this just as, Oh, we're going to do this thing. I really wanted us to be clear about what our mission was, what our goals So that kind of led to Eluminate Labs building out And he eventually exited the entrepreneurial life wasn't really working for him So, you know I really got to think about what I wanted the mission to be what I [00:10:00] wanted our purpose to be and really started that process Alongside the process of building the app that we have today 

[00:10:09] Shannon Russell: What is the app called? 

[00:10:10] Kerry Ann King: The app is called FIN Positive Productivity. And, what it offers is not just a to do list, but actual, real coaching with a real person about, what you have on your list of things you need to do and list of habits that you want to build. , we've seen it be really powerful.

particularly with the coaching, it really helps accelerate people's ability to build those habits, understand where they might be avoiding something, understand things that they need to just build those habits. Not do right like it's so powerful to have someone Look at your to do list and say you've had Return this dress on your to do list for a month and a half.

Is it really that [00:11:00] important? 

Because then what happens particularly I think for women, we are, asked to multitask so much, those things that end up on the list that don't get done just become thorns in, of whatever it is, like guilt, self disappointment.

Yeah, exactly. Like, why am I not doing this? And I should have done that. And I had to do this. And why didn't I do that? And really helping people pair things down, understand what's essential and be able to coach them on that in the moment rather than at a once a week session or in some less immediate way.

[00:11:44] Shannon Russell: That's a brilliant idea and it's kind of just that coach is the accountability partner to help you get it done or prioritize what needs to get done first. That's a great idea. I haven't seen anything like that. 

[00:11:56] Kerry Ann King: Or even, you know, break it down. Like I cannot tell you [00:12:00] how many times people put things on their to do list that are projects.

the garage. That's not a to do item. That's a two month project, depending upon how busy you are and what your garage looks like. Right. So it's really nice to be able to. , have those moments where you can help someone like understand what it is they're actually looking at.

[00:12:28] Shannon Russell: And what is the reception been like for users of the app? 

[00:12:32] Kerry Ann King: Reception has been good. I think our, our rating average, in our private ratings is about, uh, 4. 3. So not perfect, but we're getting there. It's definitely not for everyone. And this is something that I thought about a lot, like the, all I have to do is go in the app store.

There are lots of to do apps out there. It's not, That we necessarily need another one from a numbers point of [00:13:00] view. But I sincerely believe that part of the reason there's such a proliferation of those things is because everybody's needs are individual. And there is, I think, from a business perspective.

space for tiny differentiations in the market because so much of the what it means to keep track of your tasks and your habits is so individual. 

[00:13:27] Shannon Russell: I think that's brilliant. Yeah. And that brings in the inclusivity and you really thinking about what the needs are of consumers out there. Now that you built the company, are you working on other apps? And are you bringing other people on to help you with more of that tech aspect of actually developing it? 

[00:13:44] Kerry Ann King: That's a really good question. I do have two developers I work with. One is in Rwanda, and one is in Ghana.

And I have a designer who's in Washington state or actually now she's in Idaho. So I am not a technical person. I did need to go outside for that [00:14:00] technical help. And I really spent a lot of time vetting who I was going to hire. I don't know if you've ever gone on Upwork or Fiverr and tried to find someone to do something for you.

It just feels overwhelming. You start getting scam calls almost immediately. So luckily for me, my, former partner, he had connections to developers in Ghana and that kind of kicked off my, , offshore search. So I interviewed about 20 people, , really came down to looking for people who were a little bit more experienced, in working internationally and who had built their own apps.

They had built something from soup to nuts. , so they could be thought partners, not just code jockeys. Cause I knew I wasn't going to be able to supervise their work directly. So in terms of future projects, one of our future projects is actually, , software consultancy. My relationship with the guys has been great.

We have [00:15:00] fun working together. They're super smart. , they're easy to work with because the time zones are not as tight. Perfectly aligned, but they're aligned enough that it's a normal time to do business for. on both sides. So really offering kind of boutique offshoring with me as the project manager.

We have the designer available if people want, and really being able to, serve super small companies. Really we're thinking like one to a hundred people who have. the desire to build a piece of software or maintain a website or improve some sort of technical aspect of what they're doing, but find going to a Fiverr or an Upwork overwhelming.

So that's one. And then we do have a bunch of apps that we're talking about. What we're interested in as a group, , agriculture is like a big thing for all of us in different ways. , in fact, , Phil, the developer in Ghana, just, um, [00:16:00] started a chicken farm. Oh, yeah, no, it's really, it's so fun because they're entrepreneurs also.

It's so fun to work with them and like, talk through problems and get videos of Phil's chickens. 

[00:16:14] Shannon Russell: Like it's really, it's so 

[00:16:15] Kerry Ann King: cool. 

[00:16:16] Shannon Russell: Oh my gosh. That's a great collaboration. And to find those people that you trust and you're on the same page. 

[00:16:22] Kerry Ann King: Exactly. And that, I think, for better or for worse, for most very small organizations or individuals who want to build something, , in tech, offshoring is an inevitability.

We just don't have the, the talent and the talent that's here is just too expensive if you're a small organization. It's just. the way it is. And really finding, and for me it was really important to look beyond the places where we normally go for that tech offshoring. 

[00:16:58] Shannon Russell: Yeah. 

[00:16:58] Kerry Ann King: Right. It was [00:17:00] really, important to me that we were looking in Africa.

There's a very vibrant tech scene in Africa that is underutilized, so being able to also, , begin to build those connections is been Super fun and rewarding. 

[00:17:20] Shannon Russell: It's kind of all part of your mission, of creating this inclusivity in the tech space and the workplace. And it, to me, it seems like it's kind of that thread that's kind of woven through your entire career in all different aspects, right?

Just building that community and that communication. 

[00:17:39] Kerry Ann King: I really feel like. That is the key to innovation. When we are able to learn about different perspectives, see how other people do things that inspires us. to think differently [00:18:00] ourselves and to grow ourselves. And I believe so strongly that we need that for innovation.

In fact, you know, one of the reasons why I have not sought venture capital. as part of this project is because I feel like it's really important that we not concentrate the power in tech into the same smaller and smaller group of people. And that's part of what happens with venture, right? It's the same, 15 guys who are all, you know, like 15 guys.

So really kind of thinking of this as building it for us. And by us, I mean, the broadest possible definition. One of my, , kind of dream apps is I'm part of this, group on Facebook called Organic Cow. It's a bunch of, uh, folks who are trying to [00:19:00] raise their cattle organically.

I don't agree with. everything that goes on on that page, right? There are people who have opinions that I disagree with. I still would love to deliver something to them that would allow them to diagnose mastitis in their cows without resorting having to resort to Facebook because that's crazy that what people are doing is like I've seen so Facebook that I Hadn't seen before, but I didn't think I was going to see that much of 

[00:19:32] Shannon Russell: no, 

[00:19:33] Kerry Ann King: but like, that's like, these are people who need questions answered that technology could be helping answer efficiently.

And to me, that's what we need to be doing is building tech that makes ordinary people's lives easier, not. Uses ordinary people's lives to extract value. 

[00:19:55] Shannon Russell: Brilliantly said that really is. It's so incredible that you can [00:20:00] be the one creating this, a woman in tech is thinking of this and creating that, and then bringing people from all over the world together on this project to help people.

all over the world. It's really a project so much bigger than yourself. You're giving back, you're creating and then offering other people this, this tool. So inspiring to I'm sure listeners and younger women who are thinking, well, should I try to get in the tech space? It is all guys, but it's not.

There are so many women who are trying to make these big strides that you've made and it's really inspiring. 

[00:20:35] Kerry Ann King: And we need to do more, right? It's, it's very tempting. to feel like, you know, how can I possibly stem this tide, move forward when there's so many forces against me. But really that friction [00:21:00] is what creates heat.

[00:21:01] Shannon Russell: And 

[00:21:03] Kerry Ann King: If we can lean into that friction, and I'm not saying I can lean into it always, like I have my moments, trust me, where I'm like, what have I done? But I believe in the mission, and I try to use that friction to give me traction to move forward. That's the entrepreneurial journey, like, when people have asked me, what's the hardest thing about it?

number one for me, coming from really large organizations, I miss being in the office, not gonna lie. I would be in the office every day. I had a, an office with people in it to go to, , so I miss that, but then kind of being able to keep the energy to keep going when, cause like anybody who's developed an app will tell you.

It's going to break, it's going to have bugs, it's not going to be what you thought it was going to be as soon as you thought it was going to be that. It's read the lean [00:22:00] startup. I highly recommend it for anybody who's looking to move into tech. So you have to be able to like use that friction as traction.

Rather than as a reason to walk away. 

[00:22:13] Shannon Russell: Yes. And, and you're learning from the members on your team. And I think there's something really cool about the way we live now, working from home and not being in the office. I'm with you. I miss those water cooler office days, but there's something about being an entrepreneur and.

It's creating your own schedule and bringing in those people that you want to spend your time with and collaborate on. , it's incredible in its own right that you've got, you know, partners, people that you're working with that are in other countries. And you can get together, see their chickens, talk to people about their cows on Facebook.

connected in different ways nowadays, but, , the tech is just going to keep, you know, evolving and it's, it's a really cool place that we're in. 

[00:22:56] Kerry Ann King: Yeah, and I think I, I appreciate your [00:23:00] optimism. I think that's really, no, for real, because I think it's very easy to feel, , kind of overwhelmed by what's happening in tech.

Lots of people are afraid about AI. Lots of people are afraid they're going to lose their jobs. Lots of people are afraid that it's going to make it easier that rather than it. enhancing people's lives, it's actually going to be, make it easier to exploit people like, and those fears are real. I have those fears too.

Yeah. But there's so much good that could come out of this. That's one of the things that we, , we don't really have enough data to build it right now, but one of the things that we really are interested in doing. In the to do space, it's like helping people understand what to expect. if you say clean out the garage, like I can tell you my estimate is it's going to take you two months if you're being [00:24:00] real.

But imagine if what we could do is say to someone, it is, it's going to take you two months, you're going to need this many boxes, like, give people some predictability. , and one of the things that we found really interesting, and that again, we, we can only say this anecdotally right now, in terms of habit building, we've seen some really interesting trends.

For example, people seem to kind of sneak up on their habits, like they'll put a routine in their, to do list, like I want to drink more water every day. And I'll do it for a couple of days and then they won't do it for a week. And then we'll do it for a couple of days and they won't do it for a month.

But then there's like this point where it clicks and suddenly they're doing it every day and it's become part of how they do things. I think about that so much. People have, New Year's resolutions and stuff. And it's so easy when you're in that position to be like.

Ugh, I missed [00:25:00] the gym three days in a row. I'm done. It's, I'm never, I'm never going to go. It's not going to happen this year, like to get, and, but we were, what we're seeing in the app is that if you come back again and then come back again, every time you come back, even if there's days or weeks in between, every time you come back is getting you closer to that point where it's going to click.

The slow build 

[00:25:29] Shannon Russell: of a habit. 

[00:25:30] Kerry Ann King: Yeah, and how important it is, rather than get down on yourself for not doing it this time, get up on yourself for the time that, for doing it again. 

[00:25:42] Shannon Russell: Oh, that's so sweet. So 

[00:25:43] Kerry Ann King: yeah, it's really how you look at it. Yeah. Like honestly, right. 

[00:25:49] Shannon Russell: I'd love to ask you your advice for someone who is thinking about maybe switching careers and venturing into the tech space, , especially [00:26:00] women, what advice do you have, for them starting out?

[00:26:03] Kerry Ann King: I would say, I'm going to stick to speaking to non technical founders, , because I think that's the most close to my experience. I think if you're a non technical founder, you have to treat hiring your technical team the way you would treat hiring someone to renovate your house or fix your car.

They don't be intimidated. You hire experts who do something that you don't completely understand. all the time. The person, I don't understand the lady who colors my hair. I don't know what's going on. I sit in the chair and she does some stuff to my hair and then I leave and it looks better. So really thinking about, evaluating your team that does this technical thing.

It's not magic. They're not wizards. They're experts who do something that you don't understand. How do you evaluate them? And I would [00:27:00] recommend, , from my own experience. Looking at their portfolio, go into their database, even if you don't completely understand what's going on, even just how something is organized, right?

If your contractor shows up and his truck is rusty, aren't you kind of like, I don't know whether I want him to fix my house, right? That kind of stuff would be one piece of advice. And the other piece of advice I would give And this is something I wish I had followed more earlier on. Find as many people as you can to learn from, make those meetings with the random person who you don't know, but they seem to know something.

You can learn something from almost every meeting, even if what you learn is what kind of person you're not going to talk to the next time. 

[00:27:53] Shannon Russell: That's great advice. Learn what you can and. And follow your, your vibes, your heart on what feels right for [00:28:00] you. I'd like to ask you one more question about habits. So for a lot of my listeners, they are trying to maybe leave their job and start a business. Any advice on habits to maybe get into to get yourself ready for that kind of a career transition? 

[00:28:17] Kerry Ann King: I'm a huge fan of habits, especially under stress.

I think when. Things are uncertain, your habits are the things that you can go back to, to ground yourself, and I mean all of them, right? , whether it's what you do in the morning, how you manage your inbox, like all of those things help to ground you. There's some specific habits. that you want to focus on, , connect, connect with people who are where you want to be next.

Even if it's weird for you, even if [00:29:00] it's embarrassing, , I mentor in the, an organization that helps, first generation college students enter the workforce. for a lot of us networking sucks, right? I'm a very social person. I do not like to network. have to

[00:29:13] Shannon Russell: Network tonight at an event and it's like hanging over me, 

[00:29:17] Kerry Ann King: It is. a skill that you can practice, right? So get into that now. Don't wait until you're standing outside the door of where you were before and be like, okay, where am I, where are my people at? So make that a habit. And then I would say build personal habits that ground you because it's going to be a ride.

Things are going to get hairy. That's just true. I have a very kind of regular routine for my morning. , I track all of my to do's and I look every day at what I did. I use fin [00:30:00] obviously, and it has a recap section. , so you can see how you did the day before. And I look at it and I say to myself, look at what I did.

I did this one thing that was. really worrying me, but I knuckled down and I did it, yay me. This other thing I didn't do, I really want to get to that, but, you know, whatever it is intervened, like really make a habit of the things that will support you moving forward. And it can be anything like it. I do the Worldle.

Not the Wordle. I do do the Wordle also, but I do the Worldle every day. It's like a map that shows you a country and you have to guess what country it is based on the shape. I do that every morning because it's like my little like grounded routine that I have and part of it is something that's just fun and frivolous and makes me happy and I text with my husband [00:31:00] about which one of us did better.

Make those things habits too. 

[00:31:04] Shannon Russell: I love that. That is such excellent advice. Everything that you've shared has been wonderful. Where can my listeners connect with you and learn more about your app and your company and everything? 

[00:31:14] Kerry Ann King: So we're at eluminatelabs.Com. That's Eluminate with an e. Fin positive productivity is in the app store and the Android store.

, you can find me personally on LinkedIn, Kerry Ann King, and we're also Eluminate and Finn are on Facebook and on Instagram. 

[00:31:35] Shannon Russell: Wonderful. I'll link to everything in the show notes, , making sure that everyone can easily find you. And thank you so much, Kerry Ann. I really appreciate you sharing your journey, all of your acts, and all of your amazing advice.

I love what you're working on and what you're doing to make a difference in the tech world. Oh, thank you so much. This has been such a pleasure. Thank you.

[00:31:57] Speaker: Thank you for joining us. I hope you found some gems of [00:32:00] inspiration and some takeaways to help you on your path to 2nd Act success. To view show notes from this episode, visit 2ndActSuccess. co. Before you go, don't forget to subscribe to the podcast so you don't miss a single episode. Reviews only take a few moments and they really do mean so much.

Thank you again for listening. I'm Shannon Russell and this is 2nd Act Success.